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Deer Creek or Jordanelle

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Deer Creek or Jordanelle
I am heading out tomorrow and was thinking either DC or Jordanelle. Haven't been to either since kokanee season closed.

What's the best bet right now?

Thanks,
Matthew
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Re: [Outfishing13] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
It kinda depends on what equipment you have and what you want to catch.
DC small mouth, small trout, walleyes, what do you like?
Jordanelle about the same choices, maybe a nice brown trout.
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Re: [Outfishing13] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
We decided on Deer Creek. Launched the boat around 9:00am. Started out trolling with Berkley flicker shads and Yozuris. It didn't take to long before we had our first two fish in the cooler.

Continues trolling around the lake on the southern end and had to make our way into Wallsburg bay to get out of the wind. We caught about 16 and kept our limit for the day. Most were planters but we did catch some beautiful native rainbows. The biggest was about 14 inches, with most being 10-12 inch planters.

There were at least a dozen boats out fishing the lake today. Hopefully many of the planters get a chance to grow this fall and winter. If they do, we'll have some great spring fishing when the ice goes off.

This might be my last trip for the year. And it if is, it was a good one.
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Re: [Outfishing13] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
 "Most were planters but we did catch some beautiful native rainbows."

NATIVE is not correct. Holdover is more appropriate. Rainbows do not reproduce in Deer Creek. All are planted...not native.
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Re: [TubeDude] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
And if you want to get real technical about it there are no native trout in Utah but cutthroats. Unless, of course, we consider those spawned naturally in the water where they live now are "native". Dam semantics! Smile

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~~~}<(((((((((< ><=;> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ }<((((>

"Blessings upon all that hate contention, and love quietness, and virtue, and Angling." - Izaak Walton
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Re: [catchinon] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
That's what I meant. They are residents, not plants. I will start calling them resident rainbows. :)
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Re: [Outfishing13] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
Outfishing13 wrote:
That's what I meant. They are residents, not plants. I will start calling them resident rainbows. :)
All fish in any body of water are "residents". Only species that were in the water before any plantings are "native". Those that were planted and survived past the first season are "holdovers".


But what is in a name? The rainbows in Deer Creek have always been receptive to anglers, fight well and are some of the best eating in the state...IMHO.
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Re: [TubeDude] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
Pat,

Thanks for the terminology lessons. What would you call to the rainbows which were spawned and matured in Deer Creek or any other place? Would you still call the holdovers? It is pretty simple to tell the difference between the planters and those "residents". The planters are missing lots of fins where as the residence have all their fins, their bodies are shaped much different and even their flesh is redder. My father who fished Deer Creek back in the 50s as a youth said there was a species of rainbow there that has been there a really long time. How many generations before it becomes a native?

Matthew
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Re: [Outfishing13] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
Most rainbows planted in Utah today are triploids. They are sterile hybrids that do not spawn. I too fished Deer Creek going back to the 1960s...before the plantings became what they are today. And, yes, the rainbows did run up the Provo in the spring for spawning...and the browns in the fall. Natural spawning fish are known as "streambred".



I seriously doubt there are any of the original strain of rainbows left in Deer Creek. Walleyes, smallmouths, perch and brown trout all dine heavily on any fish small enough to munch...including young vulnerable trout fry. That is why DWR no longer plants fingerling rainbows. It just became the walleye feeding program with few troutlet survivors. Now they plant fewer but larger catchable size trout in an effort to help them escape all but the bigger walleyes. And those BIG walleyes do dine well on the fall plantings of 10 - 11 inch "finless Freddies".


Many of the hatchery fish are not in that bad of shape when first planted. The finless ones that survive often grow out their fins and become almost "normal" and can be mistaken for streambred fish. But assuming that a pretty 16 inch fish with good colors and all its fins was spawned in the Provo River is not a good bet.


Native? It doesn't matter how many generations of a species are "resident" in a body of water. Unless they are survivors from ancient Lake Bonneville they will never be "native." Only cutts can claim that distinction. But if you wander around the west you will find "locals" referring to brook trout and other species as "natives". Not worth going fist city over it, but it ain't right.


Flesh color? You are right about the "holdovers" having redder flesh. They are well fed on zooplankton, crawdads and other invertebrates high in vitamin A with carotene. That is what makes the flesh so pretty. Newly released hatchery fish usually have pale mushy flesh...the result of a diet of pelletized fish "food". It is nutritious enough to get them up to planting size but does not make for fine eating by anglers...until they have a chance to spend some time on a more natural diet.

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Re: [TubeDude] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
Thanks Pat! Your knowledge of Utah fisheries is amazing.
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Re: [Outfishing13] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
Glad to help when I can. But I am still learning all the time. Utah has really been a changing and dynamic fishery over the years. Completely different these days than when there were "fishing seasons"...and not much else besides trout to go after.


Oh yeah, I just happened to remember too that a lot of "Utards" still refer to brown trout as "natives".

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Re: [TubeDude] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
Oh yeah, I just happened to remember too that a lot of "Utards" still refer to brown trout as "natives".

Haven't heard that one to describe Utahans (how awkward is that one) but it made me giggle. And talking about how long you have to live in a spot to become a native or a holdover or whatever, I still don't consider myself a Utah native, just a happy resident. I am a proud Western Slope Colorado native and always will be. And to get back to semantics, the word "native" is related to "nativity", birth. As in "It was the land of my nativity."

I remember my grandfather referring to some fish as natives and I believe they were cutthroat. We dearly loved to fish the beaver ponds for "native" brook trout but I don't think he would have ever called them that. Somewhere inside I am still an eight year old slapping out the sparks from the campfire that lit on the old green army blanket while listening to the grownups talk.

~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
((> ~ ~ }<((((> ~~ }<(((((> ~ ~ }<((((> ~ ~ }<((((>
~~~}<(((((((((< ><=;> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ }<((((>

"Blessings upon all that hate contention, and love quietness, and virtue, and Angling." - Izaak Walton
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Re: [TubeDude] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
TubeDude wrote:
Glad to help when I can. But I am still learning all the time. Utah has really been a changing and dynamic fishery over the years. Completely different these days than when there were "fishing seasons"...and not much else besides trout to go after.


Oh yeah, I just happened to remember too that a lot of "Utards" still refer to brown trout as "natives".
while that aint real pc
it rolls off the tounge way easier
than utdevolopmentally disabled
or utspecialneeds
Were all them carps present in deer creek back in the flower power hippie days?
"I find i have had my reward
in the doing of the thing"
-Buzz Holmstrom
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Re: [fishskibum] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
"Were all them carps present in deer creek back in the flower power hippie days?"

Oh yeah. It was a hoot watching those poop fish cruising around in the tie-dyed scales, tokin' on rolled algae joints. Their big group "love-ins" in the spring were amazing. Not many people have heard about the lesser known "Carpstock" gathering.



Since you are a fly flingin' carp chasin' fan, I'll pass along this old remembery. Seems a lot of otherwise law-abidin' Deer Creek trout chasers chummed the rainbows to the surface in the evenings by flipping small marshmallows out onto the water. The trout slurped them up...along with some that had hooks in them. As a more frequent fairy wand waver in those days, I liked to present small white trimmed deer hair floaty flies that looked just like the marshmallows. Got plenty of trouty takers too. But on one occasion I had looked away from my fly for a few seconds and when I looked back...it had disappeared into some expanding rings of water. When I tightened up I found myself hooked to a freight train...a big carp.



Had a real tug of war up and down the bank for a while...until it finally decided to join me on the shore. I'd like to tell you I kissed those big lips and sent it back to fight another day. But in those days I was a member of the kill carp contingent. Stomped its head in before releasing it unharmed.


Always been carp in Deer Creek and they are great for sight fishing in the clear water. But they ain't easy. Takes some good stalking and proper presentations. And there are some real tanks in there. But unlike some lakes, the population is held in check by the abundance of hungry mouths. The predators eat enough of the newly hatched carplets every year that the numbers remain pretty stable.
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Re: [TubeDude] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
TubeDude wrote:
"Were all them carps present in deer creek back in the flower power hippie days?"

Oh yeah. It was a hoot watching those poop fish cruising around in the tie-dyed scales, tokin' on rolled algae joints. Their big group "love-ins" in the spring were amazing. Not many people have heard about the lesser known "Carpstock" gathering.



Since you are a fly flingin' carp chasin' fan, I'll pass along this old remembery. Seems a lot of otherwise law-abidin' Deer Creek trout chasers chummed the rainbows to the surface in the evenings by flipping small marshmallows out onto the water. The trout slurped them up...along with some that had hooks in them. As a more frequent fairy wand waver in those days, I liked to present small white trimmed deer hair floaty flies that looked just like the marshmallows. Got plenty of trouty takers too. But on one occasion I had looked away from my fly for a few seconds and when I looked back...it had disappeared into some expanding rings of water. When I tightened up I found myself hooked to a freight train...a big carp.



Had a real tug of war up and down the bank for a while...until it finally decided to join me on the shore. I'd like to tell you I kissed those big lips and sent it back to fight another day. But in those days I was a member of the kill carp contingent. Stomped its head in before releasing it unharmed.


Always been carp in Deer Creek and they are great for sight fishing in the clear water. But they ain't easy. Takes some good stalking and proper presentations. And there are some real tanks in there. But unlike some lakes, the population is held in check by the abundance of hungry mouths. The predators eat enough of the newly hatched carplets every year that the numbers remain pretty stable.
you spin good tales and i bets ya gots mad deer hair skills too
its more of an tug junkie addiction than afishyornados thing
and stupidly easy at times as well as challanging
and the stand up paddle board would be my craft of choice on that water
as it makes it both
1st season i didnt git em there
but i only tried once in the spring high water pre spawn

my first carp on the fly in utah was a helen kellar og belly boat towtruck trollin on a scud trailing a booger with a 5 weight only whippy stick i had
well funny how smokin drags into the backing can form an addiction
ya theres some turbo tanks in there
and id guess the huge amount of people on watercraft per size of water and bow fishers make em extra spooky not to mention the obxonoius annoying 2 stroke water skimming flying para fluing goons



and clearwaters tougher but sure makes better underwater photos

and mirrors


mirrors are cool
there kinda like the special kids and people
speaking with a couple decades worth of animal assisted therapy with our gentle giants fur kids through this fine org.
http://therapyanimals.org/Home.html
and my limited time spent with the NAB
fish are fish
smiles are smiles
the pursuit of both is special
if i ever get blessed to fish with my special friends on the special waters
with the special water treatment guys special tank fish
i shall certainly invite you
special things are
specially rewarding
and everbodys challenged in some manner

and while ill never be native
im a proudly utardedly local since back before the turn of the century.
im glad to know lettin them carp go and spawns little game fish predator pounds
wasnt a bad thing
i dont mind a bit of brown bycatch

"I find i have had my reward
in the doing of the thing"
-Buzz Holmstrom
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Re: [fishskibum] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
Carp are the Rodney Dangerfields of fishdom. They don't get no respect...until someone does hand to fin combat with them. If you're not too proud to take tugs from whatever source you can get it, carp will give you all you can handle.


I agree. The mirrors are kinda special...at least in appearance. In the olden days at Yuba we got more mirrors than standard issue. Still quite a few at Willard. "Back in the day" I had one take a small chartreuse fly I was flinging for crappies. Ran me into the backing on my 6 weight. I had the rod over my shoulder and throwing a roostertail going backwards in my old round tube trying to keep up with that beast. Got out to one of the channel buoys and went round and round a few times...but didn't let that wily old puckermouth wrap me. Finally got it to crawl in my net. Guesstimated close to 20 pounds. Biggest "crappie" I caught that day.


Actually, some of the best sight fishing for Deer Creek carp is somewhere after Labor Day. Once the power squadron traffic dies down and the water cools a bit there are lots of carp cruising the surface and slurping up the "algae peas" that form about this time. The right fly in the right place gets quick approvals. Also, the fish are not quite as spooky as they are when there is more traffic on the lake.


Algae peas on Deer Creek.



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Re: [TubeDude] Deer Creek or Jordanelle In reply to
i like to say well its cool that the troots only live in bueatiful places
but the poopfish can hang in the ghetto too
im a bum on a slow salt diet
trading river trips with my salt life bros bout the only way i can afford that sport
so i write all my time spent pursuing em off as bone and permit practice
should i be blessed with shots in my limited salty ops
i perfer starvation or the gorge for the big ole wise dome headed +30ers but thanks for the dc fall info/tip
"I find i have had my reward
in the doing of the thing"
-Buzz Holmstrom
(This post was edited by fishskibum on Oct 28, 2019, 11:46 AM)