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fly snaps and losing flys?

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fly snaps and losing flys?
Does anyone actually use snaps for fly fishing I noticed them recently and didnít know if I have been missing out this whole time or if they really are not worth it?

Iím guessing you know what im talking about when I say Snaps?

Also while Iím posting I might as well ask-

Why am I losing so many flyís I have switched to any where from 4x to sometimes 2x tippet and I still seem to lose more then I would like.

Polymer knot or fishermans knot? Polymer seems to be holding up a bit better but still does anyone have any suggestions.

I baby the line when I have a fish on and use all the finesse a man a has, and still.
The fish I tend to play with mostly are any where from 18 to 22 inches, wild brown trout with a fat girth but I couldnít tell you a weight.

Look forward to your replies.

I apologize if I posted the picture wrong- newby

Thanks,


image/jpeg uintahs 038.jpg (3.29 MB)

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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
I'd guess it's probably your knots. Make sure you tie them perfectly each time or the bigger fish will break them off frequently. For what it's worth I use an improved clinch knot for the fly. Review some online videos on tying knots to make sure you get them down. 4x is certainly strong enough for a 22 inch brown even in fast current. I just got an order of fish snaps from Bass Pro Shop but haven't got a chance to try them out. I'd also be interested what others think that have tried them.

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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Whats a Fish Snap ? Is it like a swivel ???

Palomar knot is a awesome knot and great for flies 18 and bigger but Its kinda hard to tie on a 20 or smaller so I use a looped knot. Heres a pretty good guide to some really good knots

http://www.midcurrent.com/...ing_knots_guide.aspx

And when in dought use use 2 or 3x tippet.

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Re: [sinergy] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
I agree totally with the LOOP knot. I use a Surgeon's Loop on all my flies. By using a loop you CAN use heavier tippet on smaller flies. For ex. I use 6X on a #32.
Also, you can get a bad batch of mono/tippet. I use only Fluorocarbon, stronger and smaller diameter.

In answer to the snaps, I have seen them but, never really wanted to try them. Heck I use furled leaders with a 2mm ring (the size of a #16 hook eye) and hear people complain that THEY spook fish (even with half the hook covered with the furl leader and the other half by tippet)...I have a hard time believing that one, but I do think the snaps could be a problem, but that is just my opinion.





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(This post was edited by flygoddess on Sep 6, 2008, 11:04 PM)

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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
some may think me a fool, but i hate tippet. i regularly use 2lb stren mono and have no problems with it. whenever i feel a strange urge i have tried tippet anywhere from 2x to 4x and always manage to have larger fish break it. i personally do not think smaller mono in 2-4lb spooks the fish at all and seems to be much stronger than tippet anyway... just my 2 cents worth

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Re: [drnympho] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
I hear ya I use both Tippet and Just regular ( P-Line or Berkley Maxx fishing line).
Normally I use tippet when dry flying Tippet seems like It gives better presentations, but If im nymphing or still water no presentations are necessary so no point in using expensive tippet I just tie on some regular fluorocarbon

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Re: [drnympho] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Absolutely! I haven't used "TIPPET" in years. I prefer the P-line or the SEAGAR Fluorocarbon. A heck of allot more for the buck and strong as heck!





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Re: [sinergy] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
I actually started using P-Line after you mention it FG CoolCoolCool

I took an old tippet spool and filled it up with P-Line Halo
and have a second spool of Berkly Maxx

Works great Im able to pull my flies out of the trees Blush with out loosing my flies Tongue

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Re: [flygoddess] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Particularly for fishing streamers, I have found the fluorocarbon to be very tough stuff. Two notes of caution:

1) It NEVER biodegrades (well maybe in 10,000 years), so be sure not to leave it in the river. Sometimes forever isn't such a good thing.

2) It has very little stretch. Nylon monofilament, depending on the brand can be much more forgiving. For steelhead in Michigan we could get away with 2 to 4 pound Maxima (lots of stretch), but rarely went below 6-lb fluorocarbon.

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Re: [MI_Steelheader] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
I don't mind the no stretch, in fact prefer it, but I also prefer full flex like Glass or Bamboo and at the most mid flex in Plastic.





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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Hey,
Thanks much for all the replies, great to hear all the opinions.

I will give that loop knot and improved clinch knot a try but most of all it sounds like I need to just keep a better eye on my knots in general.

Also I will have to put that Fluorocarbon to use I have somewhere deep it the tackle box.

As for the snaps doesnít seem like many of you really use them and that gives me a good idea to if it is a good thing or not.

Riverdog let me know what you think about them once you get the chance to try them out.

The picture thing, how do I put a picture just in the text of the post? Or at least smaller then I did at the beginning of this post? I would be more prone to posting if I could post pictures properly.

Hey thanks again,
Kngfish

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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
I'm surprised no one's mentioned spit.

I think a good old clinch knot works just fine as long as it is tied correctly. The secret is to add a little spit before you tighten it down. Goes for any other kind of knot too.
Lubrication allows the wraps to tighten correctly without stuff crossing over each other incorrectly or adding heat to damage the tippet.

I rarely use anything heavier than 4x, usually 5x or 6x and I don't think I have one in a thousand break off.

Ed

PS, always check your knot after you tie it and after you land any fish that you have to tussle with.

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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Hey Kngfish,
I tried those snaps I got this afternoon. They worked really well allowing me to change from a foam hopper to a bh prince nymph in seconds without ever shortening the leader. I don't use tippet when fishing either of those. Must have changed back and worth a couple dozen times. If bigger deeper holes didn't produce with the hopper I'd try the nymph. The action with the hopper was by far the best of the year for me so I was probable fishing it 80% of the time. Probable had 50 strikes my first hour and landed about half of them. Nothing huge but most 12-16 inches. The water I was fishing was pretty fast so lots of times the fish would be off a bit and impossible to hook. I fished another half hour but the water I got into was extremely fast and swallow, while I had probable another 8 or 10 strikes on the hopper, I don't recall actually landing any of them. The fly slides on the snap, it's a tight squeeze but there isn't a snap like a swivel. Didn't lose any flies so the design seems to work well. You still need a good knot to hold the snap but it'll be nice for those few times I want to change flies back and forth a lot. Most of the time I fish 1 fly and try to keep it in the water as much as possible so I won't bother with it then. The snaps are very small but my only concern is with smaller dries I could see it interfering with keeping them afloat. The dogs and I didn't encounter a single person and the weather was perfect. Great afternoon to be out fishing.

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Re: [riverdog] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Hey ,
Thanks for the up date on the Snaps!
Glad to hear they worked out for you, I think I may give them a try at some point.
There are times when I struggle to find what their snacking or trying to fish the different stages of a cycle and must change flies a dozen times it seems.
I could see how on the small flies it wouldnít work so well, but on big guys especially nymphs I would imagine it could work pretty well.
Glad to hear they worked out for you and sounds like you had a good time trying them out.
Thanks again,
Kngfish

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Re: [fishned] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Lubricating the line prior to tightening the knot is an excellent point. It doesn't matter what know you use if there is a lot of friction when you tighten the knot.

One other note on fluorocarbon versus nylon mono: Nylon breaks down over time, particularly in the sun. When I go to Alaska or fish Salmon or Steelhead in Michigan, I always make sure I have "fresh" line, or just fish fluorocarbon since it does not break down.

Sometimes, if you are breaking a lot of fish off, it may just mean that you have bad tippet. This can be because you have had it for a while, or because the store you bought it from had it sitting on the shelf for 3 years.

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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Those snaps seem like a good idea for a guy like me that has trouble seeing to tie the knots. Like has been said, the spit is very important. One thing that hasn't been said is the thing about how many twists are best when tying a cinch knot. After a lot of tests, that my friends at Fish Tech. did along time ago. ( before floroucarbon) The best numbers are 6, 6.5, or 7. Spit on it and pull it slow. This seems to work for me most of the time. Does anyone know if it is different with the flourocarbon leaders and tippet? I still do the knots the same.

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Re: [humpy] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
wow! mostly 18"-20" where are you fishing? Sounds like the snaps might be especially good for after dark, I'm going to give them a try. The question is - what is the difference between 2lb test line & #7 tippet material (which is usually 2lb test)? I thought they were the same animal just packaged differently. My 2 cents on knots which you probably know. If the end of the line comes back like a pig tail then the knot failed by coming untied. If it just comes back straight then the line broke. I use an improved clinch knot for terminal tying with many spins. I was guided on the Ferry & the guide would clamp the fly bend, thread the eye & spin the hemo, make a pass through the loop at the eye, lick it & cinch it up. He did not "improve it". I protested & He said I could skip the tip if the line came back curly . Well that method does not work so well for me so I always improve the knot with many spins. Works for me only my surgeon knots are now suspect, I may go back to blood knots for my leaders & tippets. I don't know.
"the princess pattern, but I don't know" what movie is that line from?

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Re: [GreatWest] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
I think you're referring to my post but I said 12- 16 not 18-20 inch trout. Unfortunately, the only places that I know you have a chance of a couple dozen 18-20 inch trout in an hour in Utah is the Green and other still waters. Having said that this is the best time of year to hit the streams looking to get into some of those bigger browns that do put up a good fight in moving water. My favorites for this are the Weber, Diamond Fork and Strawberry Rivers.

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Re: [GreatWest] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
GreatWest wrote:
The question is - what is the difference between 2lb test line & #7 tippet material (which is usually 2lb test)? I thought they were the same animal just packaged differently.


Tippet material varies allot depending on manufacturer. Generally it is a THINNER diameter then say, Vanish, P-Line etc.
Sorry I am referring to Fluoro, cause that is what I use.
Example: Vanish: 2 lb. .9 kg .006" avg. dia. 15mm
RIO 7X 2.5 lb 1.2kg .004" 0.102 mm
Orvis Mirage 6X 3.6 lb 1.6 kg .005" .127 mm


The great thing is 2 lb. will cover 7X and 6XWink





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Re: [riverdog] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Well I thought I would let everyone know my knots have started to hold up and I am only loosing one or two flies a day probably from not checking the fly/knot after catching a dozen or so of these big boys. "big for me anyway"Cool

Still haven't tried the snaps, but why switch it up when your catching!

Thanks again for all the replies!

Hope everyone is enjoying the cooler temps.
Fishing seems to be getting better each weekWink

I will be curious if my pictures show up well on the post this timeUnimpressed

Enjoy!

Kngfish

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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
uhhh? no pictures? I well have to try that again.
Inline didn't work I guess?

Cheers!
image/jpeg Big Brown.jpg (1.97 MB)
image/jpeg Big Browny.jpg (2.44 MB)

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Re: [flygoddess] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
7X, 6X, 5X, etc are diameter measurements. Breaking strength (2lb, 4lb, 6lb test), while related to diameter is a separate consideration. For example, 2X diameter Maxima might only have 6 or 8lb breaking strength while most 2X trout tippets (Orvis Super Strong, Rio Powerflex, etc) are more like 11 lb breaking strength.

The diameter is most important in considering what tippet to use with a particular size of fly. For example, throwing a size 6 hopper or stonefly with 6X would be problematic because the fine diameter would tend to twist on the back cast. Conversely, a size 20 BWO is difficult to present properly with the 3X that would probably work quite well for the hopper. Notice that this discussion on tippet diameter makes no mention of breaking strength.

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Re: [MI_Steelheader] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Very good point. I had it in my head so, didn't go any farther LOL

Tippet material is thinner, but generally stronger, that is the plus to the higher price.
Nothing I worry about till I do hit the smaller sizes like 6X and 7X.
In other words, I fish #30 and #32's, it is hard to thread 2 lb. through the eye, but 6X is no problem.
Don't forget the FROG HAIR. My favoriteCool





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Re: [kngfish] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
Nice healthy browns! Thanks for sharing the pics.

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Re: [MI_Steelheader] fly snaps and losing flys? In reply to
3 times the diameter size plus or minus 1 or whatever = fly size to use.

6x diameter= 16 to 18 to 20 fly
5x = 14 to 16
and so on so on and so forth. ( Horton the Elephant)

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