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Streamer Fishing??
I have been fly fishing for 3 years now and i cant get enough of it. But i really want to learn how to fish streamers with my fly rod. I was wondering if anyone has any tips and supplies that i'll need to start streamer fishing?

Thanks for any help!

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Re: [cwoodson] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
Are you talking Rivers or Stillwater?





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Re: [flygoddess] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
rivers

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Re: [cwoodson] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
 The way I do it is simple. I use weighted streamers most of the time. I tie them directly to the leader. I mostly cast slightly upstream and across toward the far bank or hole. They sink down in the current as the go next to the bank/ under the undercut of the bank/ under protruding limbs/ or into the hole. This is where you get most of your strikes and they're usually not subtle. If you don't get a strike you can then slowly retrieve the streamer back toward you and you will occasionally get a fish to follow and strike. I slowly work downstream repeating the process as I go. I also do quite of bit of sight fishing with streamers cast usually upstream but sometimes downstream to the fish. Just cast ahead of the fish enough not to spook them and let the current take the streamer down to them. If you misjudge the current you can pull and direct the streamer closer to the fish. My strikes are split between when the streamer goes by and the fish chasing after it. Many times you get the fish to follow the streamer downstream toward you they're so intent on getting that streamer they don't notice you there. If you just don't move much until you're setting the hook you'll catch quite a few a foot or two upstream of you. Others may do it different but this works for me. You really need to experiment on the rivers you fish based on size and clarity of the water and spookiness of the fish.

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Re: [riverdog] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
DITTO





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Re: [flygoddess] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
I recently started using a new technique with streamers that I read about online. Some of you may find interesting. Its called the JERK strip.

Im gonna copy and paste with respect to the authors. It is a bit of a read.

BY KELLY GALLOUP AND BOB LINSENMAN
A few years ago we stopped using a traditional down-and-across streamer technique and began developing more active presentations. We shed our passive, "search-and-hope" streamer techniques and attitudes and applied new methods with a calculated approach. This has made a world of difference.
We used to hook large trout on streamers only occasionally. Now we hook several large trout on each outing. What once was rare is now the norm for us because we've learned how to excite large trout and make them take the fly. You can do this, too, if you rethink your approach to streamer fishing and modify your equipment selection. The jerk-strip retrieve technique is the way to start your hunt for big fish.

The Jerk-strip Retrieve
If we could use only one method of streamer fishing for any fish in any place, the jerk-strip retrieve would be our choice because it consistently produces large fish and generates excitement. This technique can give you the rewarding feeling of having successfully hunted, located, and then moved your fly to trigger a response from the fish. It will bring out your primal instincts, and you will keep your eyes glued to the fly throughout the retrieve. When properly executed, the jerk-strip retrieve triggers aggressive behavior in large trout, resulting in spectacular charges that are almost always visible. It works well because it forces the fish to react to two basic instincts--territoriality and vulnerability. First, the fish sees prey that has accidentally trespassed into its territory and now must escape. Second, the prey seems to be slightly injured and has trouble swimming, but not to the extent that it can't escape. The jerk-strip is fast-paced and covers a lot of water. What you're trying to do is aggravate aggressive trout by covering every three to four feet of the river, as you wade or drift downstream. Cast close to the bank as possible and retrieve the fly back to your position. It is not necessary to run multiple retrieves through the same area: If the fish sees the fly, it will generally respond on the first pass. The technique either creates the impulse to smash the fly quickly, or not at all. If a fish rolls or swarms around the fly, you can make another cast, but solid hits do not usually follow mock charges. It is, however, difficult to convince yourself of this after seeing an assault. THE "ESCAPE" The jerk-strip presents your fly sideways to the fish, or perpendicular to the current. Understanding how your fly (the careless prey) would act in flowing water is vital. To escape, the prey will take the path of least resistance--a downstream or across-stream flight, not the upstream motion that a traditional retrieve mimics. Knowing that prey will take the least-difficult course for a speedy escape, you should pull the fly directly back to your position, allowing the bow that forms in the line as a result of current drag to work to your advantage. That's the beauty of the jerk-strip retrieve: It uses drag as a positive aid. Drag forces the fly's head to turn downstream. The full-sinking line keeps the fly level in the water column throughout the entire retrieve, regardless of the depth you choose. A streamer does not have to be fished deep to be effective. With this retrieve we usually fish a streamer less than a foot under the surface. We are looking for the most aggressive fish and attempting to trigger a quick, instinctive reaction. There is nothing dainty about this method, nor is it an easy way to fish. It takes practice and strength to master. The cast is aggressive. The rate of retrieve is nothing less than feverish. The line control must be timed to perfection, but when it all comes together there is no more rewarding style of fishing for big trout. Make the fly smack the water hard as close to the bank as possible. It has been said that this style of fishing is to dry-fly fishing what rock-and-roll is to the symphony. You cast the fly with force. This does not mean that you speed up your cast, but simply that you push all the way through your cast so the line energy does not run out before the end of your delivery. This is made much easier if you use a full-sinking line. The extra weight in the sinking line loads the rod quickly on the backcast, so that if you can get good acceleration on the forward cast you can push a fly hard to the surface with accuracy. Even intermediate casters can do this. Because you are not trying to fish the fly deeply, there is no reason to cast it upstream. Normally, you'll cast straight across the stream and attempt to keep the fly coming directly back to the boat. This is not a steadfast rule, however, because there are times when you must cast directly upstream and/or directly downstream. You have no control over the way the river flows or how the structure is lying in the water, so you just have to present the fly from the best angle available. You should never pass up a good-looking spot because you cannot get the perfect cast. You can't catch fish if your fly isn't in the water. Big fish are unpredictable and you can do many things to turn the odds in your favor. The initial impact on the water is the first thing the fish responds to. You want to startle the fish and make it feel crowded or trespassed upon. A hard entry also tells the fish that whatever hit the water could be injured. Think like the injured prey. Knowing there is something below you that could make you into lunch should give a sense of urgency to the moment. Once the fly hits the water, it is time to begin its "escape.". Keeping your rod tip very close to the water, almost touching the surface and pointing at the fly, jerk the rod tip 12 to 20 inches downstream aggressively. At the end of the jerk, quickly return the rod tip to its starting position and strip in the excess line. Be aware that the rod tip is moving the fly, so you must move your rod more than the 8 to 12 inches you want the fly to move, because the rod is going to flex and absorb some of the movement. You also have to deal with the current pushing your line. We have found that a rod movement of 12 to 20 inches moves the fly 8 to 12 inches. We fish the jerk-strip in all water types--slow, deep, and fast--and adjust the speed of the retrieve accordingly. The faster the water, the more aggressive the retrieve. It is imperative to maintain good line control. Stripping in the line is not intended to move the fly; it only allows you to maintain line control as you return the rod tip to its starting position so you can repeat the rod jerk. This must be done very quickly. You want to move the fly like a fleeing minnow, so repeat the jerk as fast as you can strip in the excess line. We have found that the most productive method is to keep the fly moving at a pace that lets it pause just long enough for you to strip the line back to the starting position and then repeat the rod jerk. This gives the fly a momentary pause, which signals to the fish something could be wrong, and in turn triggers the instinct to kill the crippled prey. A pause of more than one second will tell a trophy trout that the prey has either died or is no longer a threat, so there is no need for it to attack or defend its territory. This technique plays heavily on the fish's inability to shut off its basic predatory instincts of fight or flight, defend or die, and kill the weak to eat. Keep the fly moving: We are constantly amazed at how fast a big fish can appear and how little cover, if any, it takes to hide it. Continue your retrieve all the way back to the boat or, if you are wading, until the fly is within a few feet of your rod tip. Always keep it moving.

Flies and Gear[/url]
Flies. The most effective streamers for triggering big trout are big flies, from #1/0 to #10--much bigger than most nymphs, wet flies, and surface patterns. A streamer must appear as a substantial meal, threaten a fish's environs, and create the right "crippled" action. If it does all of this, it has a good chance of instigating an attack. It should also be easy to cast, otherwise you won't use it for long. Streamers fall into four groups: sculpins and Muddlers, baitfish, leeches and crayfish, and attractors. Lines and Leaders.[/url] For ultimate efficiency in almost all situations, we use sinking lines. We believe the most effective line is a weight-forward, full-sinking line in a class V or VI (available from Scientific Anglers, Rio, Cortland, Airflo, and Orvis), and we use them for about 90 percent of our angling. These lines maximize the effect of the jerk-strip retrieve and are the most effective lines for keeping a streamer in the strike zone for the entire retrieve. Sinking-tip and shooting-head lines with a floating running line, such as the Teeny-style lines, have their place in streamer fishing and many anglers prefer them, but we have found these lines raise the fly during the retrieve more than the full-sinkers. With the full-sinking lines, the initial depth is controlled by the length of the pause before the first strip. The longer the pause, the deeper the presentation. Whenever we recommend full-sinking lines to friends and clients, we hear the same response: "Those lines are hard to cast and I don't like them because I can't mend them." Actually, full-sinking lines are easy to cast, especially when you need distance and accuracy. They shoot well due to their fine diameters, which also helps in windy conditions. It's true that you can't mend a full-sinking line once it is in the water, but as you'll see, we welcome current-induced drag in the jerk-strip retrieve and use it to our advantage. An inability to mend the line is not an important concern. Leaders[/url] should be short and simple. Aggressive trout focus on the prey and its movement, not the leader. Most often a 4-foot leader composed of stiff leader material to turn over big flies will get the job done. One simple monofilament leader formula looks like this: a 24-inch, 10-pound-test tippet attached to an 18-inch 20-pound-test butt section. Sometimes we go down to 6- or 8-pound tippets, or up to 12-pound tippets, depending on the size of fly. The bigger the fly, the larger the tippet. Matching the tippet to the fly allows for better fly movement. Rods.[/url] The ideal streamer rod has a medium to medium-fast action, a powerful butt section, and enough length to lift and steer sinking lines. The rod should also cast tight loops and load quickly for accurate casts from 20 to 60-plus feet all day without tiring your arm. Such a rod should cast well in the wind and have the muscle to set large hooks on heavy fish with strong jaws that can clamp down on a fly. We believe that the best all-around streamer rod is a 9-foot, 6-weight, but we both use 7- and 8-weight rods on occasion. Reels. Large trout make strong runs, so you need a reel with a good drag to keep the fish from running into the cover of undercut banks or bolting downstream.

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Re: [Tapajos] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
Very Familiar with that retrieve.
I was going to recommend checking out the fishing STREAMERs by Kelly.
It is on Netflix!
Thanks for bringing that to the post Tapajos.

Ya know people look at me so strange when I tell them I fish full sink line on the rivers, then I met Kelly and decided to check out his video to find he does also.





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(This post was edited by flygoddess on Mar 3, 2009, 6:46 PM)

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Re: [flygoddess] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
I used to do that on the Yellowstone River out of Livingston MT with BIG old muskie streamers used in the the great lakes, weighted line, off a drift boat. We would have HUGE browns upwards of 5# and over 26'' following all the way up to the boat and smackin it right at the last second it was sure a reaction of territory. These streamers were jointed with about an inch of mono and were very lifelike, looked like a swim bait at least 4 to 5 inches long. I have seen huge fish in the green as well chasing smaller trout. This is very exciting to see these fish jumping air born to escape the massive angry fish. I found fishing that way got tiring fast but was fun to do when the fishing is slower.
http://ifishwithscott.blogspot.com/

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Re: [FOD] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
FOD wrote:
I found fishing that way got tiring fast but was fun to do when the fishing is slower.

Tiring as in boring?





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Re: [flygoddess] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
NO tiring as in fatigue, throwing heavy line and big streamers in big waters is a little bit tiring on the shoulder after taking turns rowing and putting all extra efforts to spark a strike.

I never get bored fishing their is always something different to try, i find myself night fishing a lot in the summer because I just cant get enough.

Ever got into a caddis hatch on a full moon? Its amazing I call it Zip code fishing

I should move to Alaska. J/K
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Re: [FOD] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
FOD we have got to meet up sometime and do some fishing! I know I could learn allot from watching you...and you said the key word MONTANA!

I fished a Caddis hatch once on the North Forth and the sky turned RED there were so many. Sunset and all. I should have got a picture of that.
Funny thing, I switched to a smaller nymph and was nailing them.
Kinda a bummer though cause I dry action.





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Re: [Tapajos] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
Good information. I think many of are familiar with that retrieve but I left it out because I find it not very effective Utah's mostly smaller waters. Same with the straight across hard splash, in my experience that'll spook fish on the smaller waters 100% of the time. If you're fishing a river as large as the Weber when it's flowing well (come April when they increase the flows from Echo) or larger those techniques can be very effective. I think the sinking line works well but only do it the rare times I plan on just fishing streamers. If you're on a boat easy to change spools but if you waded a mile or so and just want to switch to streamers for that section of river or didn't even plan on fishing streamers that day I'm not going to have that spool with sinking line me with me. I always have a half dozen weighted streamers with me no matter what. Again very good information but experiment, adapt and adjust things to where you're fishing at the moment. What works well on the Snake River or Green River in Wyoming with streamers won't necessarily be the same thing as want works well on Rock Creek or the West Fork of the Duchesne here in Utah. I'm ready for summer - those are 4 great places to fish streamersFishin'.

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Re: [flygoddess] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
I am sure you could teach me just as much if not more.

I am all for meeting up!! always lookin for company I just end up takin my dogs cause all my friends dont seem to be as habitual as I am.

Dont always have to bring dogs along but they seem to get better behaved every time I take them.

I think the prove would be a great place, have not hit it up for a while now.

I see your into Urban fishing also. I have spent a lot of time on the Jordan River figuring it out, but not fly fishing, that would be interesting. I know of some great spots also thought about floating it on my patchy old raft. I would almost be afraid of the possibilities.

Let me know if your bored one day and feel like fishin(im sure it is a likely event)
cheers

The invite is for ANYBODY I like meeting new people and sharing stories and laughs.
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(This post was edited by FOD on Mar 3, 2009, 8:50 PM)

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Re: [FOD] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
FOD, I have fished caddis hatches in the dark but I recall having a hard time with the constant feeding to actually know when to set the hook. Mostly tried setting the hook when the weren't hitting my fly or missing the strike altogether. Maybe I needed that full moon. Why do you call it zipcode fishing?

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Re: [riverdog] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
Its kind of a funny story. I learned the method and phrase from a guy I worked for in Montana
Out there for some reason (probably because of the willows that thickly invade the edges) the caddis hatches could go crazy, well into the night. On a full moon you could navigate and fly fish in the darkness. Seeing your fly and the strike was a hole different story. Thats why its called zip code fishing, because the fish are actively feeding in certain areas that you can cast to in the general direction you hear feeding. But you cant see much(full moon obviously helps) you only know the zip code that your fishing. Then you have to listen, feel and hope what you heard is in the same zip code that you think your fly is in. It makes for a pretty fun time.

like I said I dont get bored fishing, and love taking advantage of feeding frenzies. Day or night. I Crazythink have problems
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Re: [FOD] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
I'll have to remember that term. It was maddening fishing but a blast at the same time.

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Re: [riverdog] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
ROCK CREEK! That was my old stomping grounds while guiding in Altamont! Love that river, but gotta know where you can fish...allot of private water up there (Indian Res.) Speaking of which, with this law change, can you now walk those waters?





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Re: [flygoddess] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
I know that the indian land is not effected. All the other land on Rock creek that is private is of coarse fair game. I fished that river and the yellowstone a lot last year and found some big old browns and some of the prettiest cutthroats Ive ever seen.

Flygoddess, If you were guiding on Rock Creek in Altamont then you must have been working for the company that has the only guiding permits allowed. If it was a while ago then maybe it was different. From what I understand, their is only one guiding service that is allowed to take clients on the yellowstone and rock creek. I know you can guide anywhere without a permit in Utah except in national forest. Please correct me if I am wrong

Thats where I work BTW out in Altamont. I fished out there this summer almost everyday on either private ponds or one of the many streams or rivers. It was great to find new waters and see new places. I have fished a lot of places in Utah and that whole area has the closest resemblance to the places in montana that I lived a couple years ago. The fishing is very similar, using almost the exact same stimulators, PMX's and elk hair caddis do the trick the dry flying is incredible. One of the only guide trips that I did last year was with a guy that had not fly fished for 15 years. He had a blast because of the willingness the fish had to take a fly on the surface and he got way too exited and ripped the fly out before it hooked 9 times out of 10 anyways sorry for my long posts that are not having much to do with the first post I should be PMing smaller details anyway I love chatting so send a PM to me if you want to chat more about the area.
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Re: [FOD] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
dont apologize for a good story.. makes for interesting reading to say the least.. Smile

MacFly Cool





...."May the holes in your net be no larger than the fish in it. ~Irish Blessing"

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Re: [Tapajos] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
the only thing that is confusing me here is the sinking line.. if you are trying to maintain a foot or so of depth wouldnt the sinking line be working against you while you are waiting for the downstream loop to form for example??

MacFly Cool





...."May the holes in your net be no larger than the fish in it. ~Irish Blessing"

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Re: [macfly55] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
you have a great point!! I just knew that I was going to ramble on and on

I dont know about everybody else but when I read a post that I like, and have common experiences I get all happy and excited and want to spout out all that I know, and like to feel a bonding conversation with someone who enjoys the same experiences that I am in life, I guess its just the way I am.

This BFT forum has been very addictive to me and I cant stop putting my laptop down. I have already learned a lot. I promise it wont get in the way of my fishing adventures of 2009 or years to come but I am sure that after becoming a member I should be able to contribute to everybody the information and stories that come into play.

Thanks everybody for posting reports it is the best way help out a fellow angler that might not have time to figure it all out for themselves. I remember how I wished for something like this to be around when I started fishing. It still benefits me as an angler who wants to try and know everything that has to do with fishing and the outdoors.
Macfly: I will not detour from my tendencies to explain stories and what I am feeling and thinking just bare with me if they get too long and detailed. ThanksWink
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Re: [FOD] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
I guided a few years and about 3 years back for Falcon's Ledge. Since it has been sold. I am not sure who bought it but I know Jake Ricks guided for the other ranch up there...do you know him?
And yes, we had to have a permit for both Rock Creek and Yellowstone. We also fished the Strawberry and Current Creek.
MacFly, Kelly explains it the best. With a sinking line there is no mending. It is straight out and let it drift down. When fishing a streamer, you want the line pulling it unlike dries or nymphs which you want a dead drift or a natural.
A streamer you want to act like a bait fish.
This jerk retrieve that was mentioned is perfect when bringing the fly in.
It reminded me of the big fish on the ocean. you lift the rod, then crank when you drop the tip. Only with Kelly's way it is more to the side. You start off with the tip pointing to the fly, then pull the tip to the side, then crank or strip the line while the tip returns to the fly position. So no slack in other words.

He also mentioned, that a tandem rig was nice in that the fish would hit the HEAD of the bait fish/streamer to stun it then go back for the meal. He mentioned however, a smaller hook on the front and a bigger tandem. The opposite from allot I have seen and ones I use to make.





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Re: [FOD] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
.. I dont mind the long posts at all.. especially if they show me something Ihave never seen as that peaks my interest for sure.. thats what I meant by the comment.. dont apologize for something that needs no apology (that was clear as mud wasnt it.. lol)..

MacFly Cool





...."May the holes in your net be no larger than the fish in it. ~Irish Blessing"

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Re: [flygoddess] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
   I figured you had to have worked for Falcons. Thats where I work now!!, I am the chef there and guide when its my turn. Getting my foot in the door to be a guide in Utah was practically impossible and I am lucky that I have good culinary background to even be in the industry. I am making my stand at Falcons for now. Its great to have so many resources as I can do all sorts of stuff out there. I know Jake well sad to see him go(getting married/moved to AZ) but Spencer is running Falcons now which was bought by the company that owns Six lakes and Hidden Springs Ranch and are all part of a company called Recreation Properties Unlimited. The land is kind of a monopoly out there if you ask me. They also own lots of land in Pleasant Valley that is used by the pheasant preserve( they now also own). I also worked at the preserve a lot when the summer slowed down. I am an avid hunter of all categories. I had a great summer and fall this last year.

couldnt decide which I liked better the POND fishing or the STREAMS. I am sure after a while the rivers win. I like to hike up stream and find new holes and fish a little more aggressively, the ponds are fun dont get me wrong.

I caught some of the largest fish on the ponds this last year it was great. I know I hooked into the 10 # tiger trout that lives in the pond up the hill. I feel kinda spoiled out there. I am sure i dont have to tell you. Those are record fish if it werent private. I started tying flies at Falcons at night. They have a sweet setup I can just sit and tie flies, try new ideas and then go out the back door and test them out. My latest fly was the Captain pepe le pue. I am not a good enough tier to try to explain the pattern but it looks like a skunk. I tried to imitate a dying flathead minnow the white stripe on the back of the fly seemed to look like the belly of a minnow so it seemed dead being upside down and all I found that an olive and rust marabu combo looked better than black and ended up catching more with the skunk stripe on that color scheme.

I could go on for ever about the whole area out there, but lets just go fishin plenty of time to talk about all.
http://ifishwithscott.blogspot.com/
image/jpeg SV400367.JPG (1.68 MB)

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Re: [flygoddess] Streamer Fishing?? In reply to
on the tandem its opposite.. smaller on top.. larger on the bottom?? would they both be the same type fly.. i.e. both clousers??

my impression (minds eye) is a sinking line will drag the fly deeper than what he said as as example (1 foot) before the loop downstream can be formed .. is my minds eye off on this one.. ??

does it all happen so fast that the fly doesnt have time to sink too deep and that is what he meant about getting the timing down??

you know how Joan Wulffs video shows how to do an upstream cast so you dont get that drag.. could you reverse it in this instance and flip the line downstream.. maybe causing the loop to form faster???

I like the idea of the technique and know of at least one stream in TN Ill be trying it out on this summer..

dont know about ya'll but I can also see this technique working well on stillwater from a tube or toon.. turned into shoreline.. cast.. let it settle a bit.. jerk.. realign.. settle.. jerk..much like a spinning or baitcasting angler would do with say a plastic shad ... but maybe on a floating line since you dont have the downstream loop to help you out... what do ya'll think??

also.. may I suggest one thing.. especially on this post.. that it be copied or repeated on the main ff'ing forum.. Im sure it would be of great benefit to all over there as well..

MacFly Cool





...."May the holes in your net be no larger than the fish in it. ~Irish Blessing"
(This post was edited by macfly55 on Mar 4, 2009, 2:14 PM)

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