Qusetion about fishfinder power drain.

[hustler898]

I'm not all that electronically inclined so hopeing someone can clear this up for me.

According to the owners manual for the Cuda 168, current drain is 110 ma with lights off. I'm guessing that is per hour and that 1000ma = 1amp. Is this correct? If thats true wouldn't it take like 20 hours to drain a 5 amp battery 50%? Wondering because I'm testing the five amp battery with my finder to see how much time of use I can get out of it. It's been on for 5 hours now and the meter I purchased still reads full. The next lowest increment is 2/3 full so It would take hours of draining to get the battery that low.

If thats the case this meter is useless cause it won't accually tell me when the batter is fully charged and prevent overcharging. I'll have to go out and pick up an inexpensive volotometer and relly on that.

With the above in mind what should the voltage be on a fully charged 12 volt battery? If I recall corectly it's between 12.7 and 13? Also what is the lowest voltage I should let the battery drain too?

Thanks
[signature]

[TubeDude]

[cool][blue][size 1]Hey Al, now you are "getting under the hood". [/size][/blue]

[#0000ff][size 1]I can't remeber where I got the specs, but I have relied on the formula that those low powered Eagle units (like mine) suck about a half amp per hour of steady use. That means that your five amp battery should hold up for about 10 hours before your screen flickers out. [/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]One big consideration is that you shouldn't drain those SLA batteries completely before recharging to the max. They are not designed to be "deep cycle" batteries. But, unless you go for a marathon trip, you should not have to worry about completely draining it. [/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]I have tested my batteries several times with inexpensive testers. Most of them show only that the battery has a charge, and not the percentage. I know there are testers that will measure the capacity of a battery and give a readout as to how much is left. I also have never had a battery run out of juice on a fishing trip, and I use a 6 amp.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]If you ever upgrade to a high wattage unit, the game will change. Some of those babies really suck the juice out of a battery and you will either need a bigger battery or take two out with you on long trips.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]But as long as we are content with our basic sonar for float tubing, we can do fine with the smaller SLA batteries. I got well over two years of hard use out of the last one I retired. When I used to use the acid filled motorcycle batteries I was lucky to get a full year. They were also more dangerous, heavier and required special handling and mounting in the tube to keep from spilling.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]You can do the research and the math if you want. I am content to just keep my battery charged and ready for a fishing trip whenever I can get away. Then, one of the first things I do when I pull back in the garage at the end of the trip is hook my battery up on the trickle charger to restore it as quickly as possible.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]By the way, most of those little low voltage chargers are either 500 or 800 miliamp. Rough translation is that they add about a half to 4/5 amp per hour of charging. In most cases, if you leave the battery on the charger about the same amount of time you used it, you will do okay.[/size][/#0000ff]
[signature]

[tubeN2]

Most electronics today are designed to operate at + or - 1 volt. That does not constituted running your battery down to 11 volts though. You can still run your battery safety down to 12.0 volts but I wouldn't try to go less than that and as TubeDude said, get it back on the charger soon after.

My sonar tends to drain my battery by .2volts in about 5 hrs of use. It will read 12.7 when I get on and finish at 12.5 after the 5hrs on the water. My sonar has a built in battery meter so that I don't have to hook up any other instruments.

I did notice that my battery does drain faster when I run the volume too loud on the stereo system in my tube. That drops it another 2 points over the same amount of time.
[signature]

[hustler898]

My little trickle charger has an output of 500 ma. The reason I ask is the "battery specialist" told me that I should fully charge after every use but not overcharge to extend the life of the battery. He also told me i didn't need one of those facny chargers just an inexpensive volt meter.

Just confusing because if the unit pulls 110ma per hour and the charger adds 500ma per hour, charging the battery for the same amount of time as it has been used will result in an overcharge everytime, hence reducing the life of the battery. According to the specialist I should get many years of normal use out of it.

Just makes me wonder if your getting 2 yrs of use TubeDude is it possible that you may be overcharging everytime? Just a thought.
[signature]

[hustler898]

Thanks for the info. So 12.7 is full and 12.0 could be considered empty. The most I would need out of the battery is about 8 hours of use between charges, seems like this battery will give me that easily.

Thanks
[signature]

[TubeDude]

[cool][#0000ff][size 1]Hey Al, no discredit to your "battery specialist", but I have had input and advice from several sources whose credibility I tend to trust too. Here are some of the basics I have been led to believe:[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]1. The inexpensive little chargers typically used on our SLA batteries are not like the big chargers we use for car batteries. They put out higher voltage on a low charge battery and then decline as the battery gets more charged. In other words, five hours on the charger is not likely to overcharge the battery. To the contrary, it will probably still not be at full capacity.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]2. SLA batteries were designed as backup batteries for sensitive electronics, and are regularly hooked up so that the chargers are always on...maintaining them near peak power.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]3. Although SLA batteries can withstand a few big drawdowns in power, they are adversely affected by "deep cycling" and that contributes more to reduced life than "overcharging" ever could. In the writeup on the website linked below, there was a quote of 300 to 500 charging cycles being about the max life for a SLA,,,lower than some other rechargeable types. It also pointed out that this number would drop if the cycles were deeper.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]I am still learning and experimenting. In the final analysis, all I care about is getting a reasonable price on my battery and getting at least a couple of good years performance from it. Anything beyond that is a bit pretentious and ambitious. As I have said before, I was used to getting less than a year from a liquid acid motorcycle battery. And, before that, I was lucky to get two or three trips from a pair of 6 volt lantern batteries wired in tandem to produce 12 volts. That became expensive, and the power was not nearly as reliable.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]For anyone who might like some good background info on SLA batteries, check the link below.[/size][/#0000ff]

[url "http://www.cycleboost.com/downloads/slabatts.pdf"][#333366][size 1]http://www.cycleboost.com/downloads/slabatts.pdf[/size][/#333366][/url]
[signature]

[hustler898]

Hey TD thanks for the doc. answers alot of my questions, especially about the full charge and how low it should go . As far as the "battery expert" He was the owner of the store in which I purchased the battery and very believable since rather than trying to sell me more expensive equiptment he focused on educating me in the use and maintanence of the battery.

So those little trickle chargers acually vary in output as full charge is reached.

Thanks again.
[signature]

[hustler898]

Was tooling around and decide to check out the battery manufacturers web page. Here's what I found for the battery I have: Basically what thier saying is full charge should be 14.4 - 14.7 volts. Very interesting

Power Sonic ps 1250 f1 12v 5.0 amp hr. from [url "http://www.power-sonic.com"]www.power-sonic.com[/url]; Charging Cycle Applications: Limit initial current to 1000mA. Charge until battery voltage (under charge) reaches 14.40 to 14.70 volts at 68º F (20º C). Hold at 14.40 to 14.70 volts until current drops to approximately 50mA. Battery is fully charged under these conditions, and charger should either be disconnected or switched to "float" voltage.

"Float" or "Stand-by Service": Hold battery across constant voltage source of 13.50 to 13.80 volts continuously. When held at this voltage, the battery will seek its own current level and maintain itself in a fully charged condition.
[signature]

[TubeDude]

[cool][blue][size 1]Good Stuff. We gonna be ex-spurts someday here.[/size][/blue]

[#0000ff][size 1]I do gotta ask though. What kind of onboard charging system are you using...solar, wind, leg power or "natural gas"?[/size][/#0000ff]
[signature]

[hustler898]

[] was thinking about natural gas since it is free and usually wasted anyways. Easy to produce too just give me some beans and broccolli and I will provide enough power to run a small city for a few hours. Got it all planned out too!!! Got some rubber tubing to provide a pipe line just need to figure out how to hook it up to the battery as a charging system. Maybe some of you more Edgu-ma-cated peeps can chime in with some ideas.
[signature]

[hustler898]

OOPS, forgot to mention, toying around with the battery..., actually (scratch that) conducting scientific groundbreaking research [] and discovered once it hits that full charge point (14.7 volts) under charge it a starts a hootin and a hollerin and it aint not whistlin dixie mind you. I think it gets a bit of gas of it's own. Wnen I put my ear up to it it I can hears it a grumblin. It continued to "off gas" until it dropped to about 13.5 volts, so my guess is that thats the full charge with open circuit.

Next comes the "balistics test", We's gonna hook that sucker up to the car battery and charge that puppy to finds out at wut voltage she goes BOOOOOM!!!!

Will post my results [crazy]
[signature]

[TubeDude]

[cool][blue][size 1]Don't forget the "burnoff" system for excess gas production, like they have on methane producing landfill opertions. The perpetual flame could be a real boon for night fishing, and you could convert it to a heating system during cold weather.[/size][/blue]

[#0000ff][size 1]The major divantage is the user non-friendly aspects. Don't know as I would want to be a "fishing buddy" if I had to fish downwind from ya.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]During the months you had to wear waders, the "output" would likely cause deterioration of the wader material too. No such thing as a pinhole leak. Can you say disintegration?[/size][/#0000ff]
[signature]

[TubeDude]

[cool][blue][size 1]I'll just watch the late news for the report...of the mysterious explosion in your area.[/size][/blue]

[#0000ff][size 1]Glad there's some miles between us.[/size][/#0000ff]

[#0000ff][size 1]You dangerass mon. You bin tokin' on dat Ganja weed.[/size][/#0000ff]
[signature]

[Dryrod]

[cool][#004040][size 2]Don't know too much about Ben Franklin's stuff but I do Know with these types of batteries you don't want to fully discharge them. As TD mentioned [drain down]. I have the Cuda 168ex but haven't been able to find in the manual or on line how much the unit will drain my battery in a given hour. The last time out I had it on for about 3½ hours. My battery is a 12V 7amp. unit. For the heck of it I just tested the voltage and it read 13.5. Unforntunately meter testers won't give you an accurate picture since there is no load on the battery accept the testing devise. You can take weak batteries out of your flashing and a test might show a good charge. Turn on your flashlight and the light will go from fairly bright to dim or nothing. Now test the batteries and they won't get the needle out of the red zone. [/size][/#004040]

[#004040][size 2]I thought fishing was all about putting a worm on a hook and throwing you line in the water. Now I have to learn all about [/size][/#004040] [font "Symbol"][size 4][font "Symbol"]W. [#004040][size 1]and stuff like taht[crazy][/size][/#004040][/font][/size][/font]
[signature]

[hustler898]

The manual I have incorporates the 128, and 168 families, including the EX. It shows the same current drain for all finders (110ma lights off & 250ma lights on). If our manuals are the same you will find this info on pg. 2 "current drain".

From what I can see by looking at the manual the cuda 168 and 168EX are identical in every respect except for case size and a larger screen. I was tempted to go for the EX for another 20 bucks but decided against it do to it's size. Larger viewing area is always nicer
[signature]

[hustler898]

No Ganga mon, don't need it, high on life and occasionally a few brewskis or a Martini [cool]. Don't worry mon overcame the urge for the "ballistics test" I think it was a bout of temporary insanity do to kneeling down in the path of the transducers sound waves While I was conducting my groundbreaking scientific research [laugh] I guess it screwed with my brains normal electrical activity. By the way it showed up as a rather thick "grey line" guess that means no air in there
[signature]

[Dryrod]

[blush][#408080][size 2]Duh - yes, it was on page 6. I downloaded their PDF manual and completely missed the Current Drain: line. Then again what makes you think that I understand all that jargon. [/size][/#408080]
[signature]

[hustler898]

Hee Hee, Yeah I can relate "current drain" I think "current" how fast is it flowing? Will the fishies be able to hold up in it? When does the tide change, kinda hard to keep up with it? [shocked] Now "drain" Is that like the plug at the bottom of the bath tub pull it out and drain the current? Why would someone want to do that?[laugh]
[signature]

[Dryrod]

[#408080][size 1]Something else to consider:[/size][/#408080][font "Arial"][#408080][size 1]Sealed batteries or {SLA} the leak-proof Lead Acid variety require different charging methods than those used with NiCad (Nickel Cadmium) types.
It is important to keep Lead Acid batteries fully charged and to re-charge these battery types as soon as possible after every use. Unlike NiCad batteries, Lead Acid batteries do not have a memory so there is no benefit to deep discharging and in fact if completely discharged like a NiCad will in fact begin to internally corrode and eventually will fail. NiCad type chargers and those used for common household appliances are constant voltage and not suitable for Lead Acid battery charging. A proper SLA charger charge based on the battery condition and automatically sense battery condition to insure the battery is given a Bulk, fill and maintenance charge when connected.
A standard overnight recharge is normally recommended for typical lead-acid batteries.
This is based on a C/10 charge rate. (C=Ah capacity of your battery)
Example: If you have a 12 Volt, 25 Ah battery then your charging rate is 2.5 Amps (C/10 = 25/10 = 2.5)
The Ah rating of the battery x 1.2 equals the amperes required to recharge, divided by the charging circuit, equals the amount of time (in hours) required to recharge the battery to 90%.
These times are basedon a fully discharged battery.
For 100% recharging, add 3 hours "float" time to the charging time.
If the battery is only partially discharged, the recharge time will be shorter.
Since the recommended voltage setting for each battery type varies, follow the manufacturer's specifications to determine the correct voltage setting for each charger. This will help to insure maximum battery life and will provide the most efficient recharging possible.[/size][/#408080][/font]
[signature]

[hustler898]

Some more good information. As TubeDude say's "we gonna be ex-spurts someday here" Thanks for the info.
[signature]