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[cool][#0000ff]Our recommendation to open Yuba to perch harvest next year went down without a ripple at the DWR board meeting today. Since it did not make it onto the table by July 1, it was not even worthy of consideration. The 8-2 vote in favor, at the RAC meeting, was not even brought up. Roger Wilson's suggestion to the board, when a board member asked about it, was to "stay the course"...no changes.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I wasted a lot of time, energy and gas money trying to work this through the system. I won't make that mistake again.[/#0000ff]
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That's too bad. The wheels really do turn slow. Please don't give up. The solution is to get you on the Wildlife Board.
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what pisses me off is that Roger Wilson is trying to hold the public to a DWR policy. That's NOT RIGHT!!!
The public should be able to present a recomendation whenever they want. If the DWR has no reason to stop that recomendation, it should be passed through.
If the DWR wants to make a change, they should follow policy, but forcing the public to follow their rules sucks!
What's  , is that the public is quickly learning that the RAC system NEVER works in the publics favor!
Tubedude -- thanks for your efforts. At least you can rest easy knowing that the regulation change will be made next year.
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Sorry to hear about your bad experience, and results, Pat. I've had the same experience in hearings at the state capital. They try to make the common folks feel good by allowing them to come and to speak, based upon the faulty assumption that what is said will actually be considered by the decision makers. Only to quickly realize that decisions have already been made and they could care less what the common folks are saying.
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[cool][#0000ff]Thanks, Bro. I appreciate the help you provided and the immoral support.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]It wasn't all bad. I did meet some good people and learned a lot more about the "system"...some of it was even positive.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I did not take the rejection personally. I have lots of places to fish, if I want to bring home some perch fillets. Believe it or not, my efforts were more for the fathers and grandfathers down in that area that want a place to take the young anglers in the family to get them into some fish.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The only upside is that by the time the lake opens to perch harvest, it will be even more choked with 'em, and there will be more bigguns. The downside is that there will be fewer angler hours on the lake this year and a lot of harvestable fish will remain in the lake. Also there are likely to be more citations issued for people who keep perch, whether "accidentally" or on purpose.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]After this go-round, I can't see a good reason for ever attending the RAC meetings...or even for keeping the system.[/#0000ff]
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Thanks for the effort you put in. I know the one thing that the DWR does not like is to look bad. It is too bad that we cannot get a 3rd party Biologists to come in and give a public report on how over crowded the water is down there. And at the way things seem to move in government you will be able to play Jesus and walk across the lake with out getting wet on the backs of fish.
Majja
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That's really too bad Pat. I appreciate all the work you did on the matter, and it's too bad it had to fall on deaf ears. Perhaps the DWR needs to listen to the people a little more. They complain of declining revenue, but when given the chance to open up a fishery that could generate some license sales, they just acted like it's no big deal. Once again, thanks for your footwork on the matter.
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[cool][#0000ff]The biologist for Yuba Lake (Don Wiley) completed a net survey in the spring, documented his findings (lots of perch) and submitted his recommendation that the lake be opened to perch harvest. Too Late. Anything beyond a few minutes over deadline is TOO LATE.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Last Friday DWR did another net survey, just to double check. Results? Bajillions of perch in both the gill nets and the trap nets. Everybody agreed there are LOTS of perch in the lake...and not enough walleye or pike to keep them under control.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]Still, there is not enough "evidence" to justify making a change at this time. Translation? We would rather make NO decision than a potentially WRONG decision. Now, everybody can coast through next year on this one, not worrying about any kind of bad publicity for "rocking the boat".[/#0000ff]
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it dont surprize me one bit [unimpressed]!!
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Well Dude, we tried.
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[cool][#0000ff]Yeah, thanks fer the ride. [/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I'd druther go fishin'.[/#0000ff]
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Well TubeDude, like you said we have lots of places to fish for perchies so if the over feed helps the walleyes come back faster I can wait on the perch. Fish On.
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[cool][#0000ff]Fishermen are like doctors...gotta have patience (patients).[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]I can wait out the regs. Should be lots more big perch in 2008. Of the 4 year classes identified, the two largest at this point are the ones that were planted...and there really aren't that many of them.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The first year's good spawn are now in the 8" to 9" range. They will be 11" to 12" by the middle of '07 and will be mega toads when the lake is opened in '08. The really good news is that Yuba is full of that year class right now so they are too big for walleye and plenty big enough to spawn a bunch of new babies.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]The downside, for the walleye fans, is that the hordes of perch are eating everything in sight. When the walleyes do spawn, the perch are likely to slurp up a lot of the new wallettes too. Really supports the old adage "eat or be eaten". With perch it is eat AND be eaten.[/#0000ff]
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[#0000ff]But, we all know that once the "balance of power" shifts, and the walleye population explodes...as it always does...then the perch will be on the run and the crash will happen. The only thing that can delay it is to have a few more wet years. The perch need the high water and submerged vegetation to spawn, whereas the walleyes don't. A couple of dry years in a row and it will be all over again.[/#0000ff]
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Sorry about the disappointing outcome. I know you worked your tail off on this. I think the most troubling lesson learned about the RAC process is that due to inflexible internal rules and deadlines, a recommendation that has merit, even if approved by the RAC committee, would appear to require about 18 months to be implemented. For some suggestions that would present no problem, but in others, that huge lag time could be problematic.
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Well Pat it was a good try.I guess we will be doing c&r on perchies.But can you just imagine the biguns that were are gonna be catching in 2008! ]
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Well you guys have raked me over the coals about this, so I would like to respond to try to put some balance in play. Anglers last September (2005) made an unsual request of the aquatics DWR guys. We asked that they give us a preview in May of what regulations they would like to change so we could mull them over before the September meetiing. Just as importantly (or more so if you want my opinion) the May meeting is an opportunity to request the DWR to make reg changes for the September meeting. It was set up as a two way street: they listen to us and we listen to them. No RAC actiion in May, just verbal exchanges.
Then in September, the DWR can incorporate requests from the public made in May, and the public (and the RAC) can recomend that reg changes brought up by the DWR not be done (or be amended etc). Again, a two way street.
This was a process that the anglers and DWR entered into for a few years trial to see how it would work.
I have a hard time believing that Yuba was "discovered"" to have too many perch all of a sudden such that no one, in May, had the inkling the reg changes should be made. If this was important to you (and in the future, if reg changes are important to you) then why did you not show up in May to make the suggestion? If you had, I would have bet a Sage fly rod that you would have gotten the reg change for 2007.
The anglers on the central RAC got this preview system adopted by the DWR, so hell, use it. Use the system instead of just complaining. In the past, you had one time for input, the Sept. meeting when the proc was already written, and now you have a chance to mold the process before it even gets started.
So make a list right now of changes you want to see, and add to it over the winter, and then show up in May and make the suggestions. You may get your way a lot more than you expect. Andd you'd probably get my vote.
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[size 1]The anglers on the central RAC got this preview system adopted by the DWR, so hell, use it. Use the system instead of just complaining. In the past, you had one time for input, the Sept. meeting when the proc was already written, and now you have a chance to mold the process before it even gets started.[/size]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][black][size 3]You seem to assume that everyone knows the procedures and protocol used in the process of trying to get certain agendas through the RAC process. Heck, even our resident "experts" didn't realize what needed to take place! This is the problem with the current system. Unless you stay abreast of every decision made, you are behind the times and out of luck until another year. [/size][/black][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][black][size 3]You may have got racked over the coal so to speak but you neglect to realize that almost all of us do not know the system as you do and only try to become involved when issues surface that we wish to try and make a difference. Please forgive us that we know so little of how things really work! [/size][/black][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][black][size 3]I do thank you for enlightening us. I have a better understanding of the inter-workings of trying to make changes in the current system. If there are agendas I wish to become involve with, I won't waste my time on the fall meetings and concentrate in the spring on agendas I wish to become involved in. Hey, as tough as it is, sometimes you just have to learn the hard way! [/size][/black][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][size 3]Oh, BTW, welcome to the site. Your participation here is welcomed and your insight and knowledge could help a lot of us better understand what needs to be done to get involved and make a difference. Don't be a stranger and help us make a difference.[/size][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][black][size 3]You seem to assume that everyone knows the procedures and protocol used in the process of trying to get certain agendas through the RAC process. Heck, even our resident "experts" didn't realize what needed to take place! This is the problem with the current system. Unless you stay abreast of every decision made, you are behind the times and out of luck until another year.[/size][/font][/reply]
When this process was put into place we requested, and the DWR responded, by advertising the May meeting in the Proclamation, and it was on the DWR web page. I even think the newspapers carried a blurb on it.
Regardless, (and I see and can appreicate your  in the cheek sarcasm), now people will know that is the process, and they can now participate.
But if you really want a reg change, especialy if it is at all controversial (such as out-lawing bait fishing at Strawberry) then you would be wise to attend May to make the proposal, September to fight for it, and maybe even Ocotber with the wildlife board to be seen and heard again.
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][size 1][reply]
[font "Comic Sans MS"][size 1][/size][/font]But if you really want a reg change, especialy if it is at all controversial (such as out-lawing bait fishing at Strawberry) then you would be wise to attend May to make the proposal, September to fight for it, and maybe even Ocotber with the wildlife board to be seen and heard again.
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][black][size 3]This is great info. Thank you. If this type of info was known before the our Yuba Cru ers embarked upon their mission, they may have taken a different course. As Tubedude said, he knows a lot more about the system than he did when he started this. Hopefully the failure of a first attempt will not deterr his efforts now that he is more educated and able to be more effective with his new found knowledge. I know I have a better understanding.[/size][/black][/font]
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[font "Comic Sans MS"][black][size 3]Again, welcome to the forum. Your participation, as I said before, is welcome and enlightening. A more well informed public is able to make more educated decisions and arguements concerning these types of matters when able to see all sides.[/size][/black][/font]
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You have a hard time believing that Yuba was just "Discovered" to have to many perch.
That says to me that either the netting surveys done in the spring are to late, or not accurate measurements of populations or that you failed to review the data. Don't try to spin this into being our fault unless you are asking us to run this show for you. In which case quit and move on.
We are not talking about a 15 year old lake trout where we have time to make adjustments, we are talking about a 5 year fish and taking 2 years to tweek management of them. In the past there have been special and emergency regulations put into place for various reasons (dam repair) this request was not even close to that.
So you are challenging us to make lists for the spring meeting, you better be ready to rent the Delta Center and take 5 days to conduct the hearings in May.
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