Posts: 144
Threads: 0
Joined: Jun 2007
Reputation:
0
Ok. I have been looking up stuff just curious to see if it is possible to tie a fly without a vice. I found it is possible but none of the articles that talk about it go into detail on how to do it yourself so I decided to come here to see if anyone knows how? or if anyone knows a resource that at least explains how it was once done? Thanks. I just don't have the money to spend on a vice. I do want to tie flys though. Worse come to worse I am just going to figure it out all from scratch. I know it is out dated but even though it is an outdated and probably mostly long forgotten art form I still would like to learn how to do it as well I just don't have the money for a vice. I think more than likely I am just going to have to figure it out from scratch. The earliest I have heard of it being done is 2005 but the man ESPN interviewed did not give instructions. ESPN says he is probably the only one in America doing it. I think I am going to try and tie one from scratch with no tools except scissors to cut line. I am going to try and come up with my own method to do it without proper tools.
[signature]
Posts: 871
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2006
Reputation:
0
[black][size 3]I assume that you do not presently tie.[/size][/black]
[size 3]Tying flies is difficult enough to learn, without making it worse.[/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]I guess that a fly can be tied without a vise, I've read about it somewhere, but why make it more difficult?[/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]Even if you were able to get all the material proportations right, you would only be able to tie large flies. [/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]If the cost of a vise is not within your budget, then the cost of materials will kill ya.[/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]I don't mean to rain on your parade, but until you can afford to get into tying, you should buy flies. Believe me, people who tie, don't do it to save money. I've tied for about 40 years, for myself and friends/family, and I would have been hundreds of dollars ahead if I would have bought flies instead.[/size]
[size 3][/size]
[signature]
Posts: 871
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2006
Reputation:
0
[black][size 3]Last night, I left the above posting, and this morning after a little thought, I realized that I may have sounded a little discouraging about starting to tie flies.[/size][/black]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]So, I got to thinking this morning: What would I do if I had to tie without a vise or a major investment in materials.[/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]I think that to minimize my cost and commitment, I would use a "vise grip" tool, carefully adjusted to hold a hook, and then maybe use a C clamp to hold it to a table edge. This same setup could also be used by someone wanting to tie up some custom jigs.[/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]It's very difficult to handle thread control without a bobbin, so an investment in a good bobbin would be in order. (get one with a synthetic tube lining)[/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]My next action, would be a visit to a local [black]sporting goods shop, and talk with someone there to get some hooks, and a limited amount of quality material. Some chenille, thread, small pack of good hackle, and you should be in a position to tie up some woolly buggers or other wet flies. There are sources on the net that will show you step by step instructions for tying. [/black][/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]I hope that this helps, If you have questions, just post here, and we'll get you some answers as best that we can.[/size]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3]BTW, I think that it was fly fishing legend Lee Wulff, inventor of the Wulff series of flies, who was purported to have tied without using a vise.[/size] [black][size 3]Most of his efforts were directed toward Atlantic Salmon.
[/size][/black]
[size 3][/size]
[size 3][/size]
[signature]
Posts: 19,235
Threads: 2
Joined: Nov 2005
Reputation:
1
There you go Saber. In a pinch, I have used one of the Leatherman tools that had the vise jaws. Opened up the knife blade and stuck it in a tree branch and clamped the hook. It works. I have heard people say they can tie a flie using their hand only....haven't tried that one yet, but I think it could be done if you do Old School and use wire instead of thread.
[signature]
Posts: 144
Threads: 0
Joined: Jun 2007
Reputation:
0
I am use to people discouraging difficult ideas but then what fun would life be without a little difficulty? Plus could you imagine the benefits of learning to tie flies without a vice? I could tie flies while I was fishing. They don't have a very good selection of flies at the tackle shop and I doubt Wal-Mart flies will work very well. I have collected feathers and I figure maybe tie them on with fishing line. I figure try and make it look like a bug on top of the water. It is a little vague but I figure I can make it a bit more complicated I just did not want to post my whole idea. I will figure something out through trial and error. I am going to be saving for a vice and until then I am going to work on coming up with a way to tie them entirely by hand. I was hoping to get into fly fishing so I did not get mad every time I went and lost a lure. Lures are expensive. I could afford a cheap vice but I want to save for a good one as I keep hearing that clamp on vices suck and that you get what you pay for and I am better off saving for a good tool set. I saw one at Cabelas on their web site.
[signature]
Posts: 896
Threads: 0
Joined: Apr 2006
Reputation:
0
I have seen a couple of people tie flies with out a vice (John Betts for one but can not remember who the other person). It is amazing to watch.
The guy you saw on ESPN has a good chance of being John Betz. He has developed a number of innovative products for fly tying and fly fishing. (Such as Z-Lon and gold and silver plated feathers.) He was the "Fly Fisherman of the Year" ( [url "http://www.flyrodreel.com/index.php/page/issues/sku/FRR2006_04/id/19082"]http://www.flyrodreel.com/index.php/page/issues/sku/FRR2006_04/id/19082[/url]) His artful creations have been on the cover of Fly Tyer magazine a number of times. If I remember correctly that is the only way he ties. I don't remember much at all about how he does. I decided I did not want to mess with it. Being fumble fingered I figured I stick enough hooks in my fingers with out trying that.
I do not know of any sources of instruction for tying without a vise. I did read a short article in Fly Fisherman magazine a few years back.
You might think about buying a Danvise. For the money it is an excellent vise. It is what I tie with for the last 5 years. You see a good number of people tying with them at fly tying events.
[url "http://www.artsnflies.com/pages/danvise.shtml"]http://www.artsnflies.com/pages/danvise.shtml[/url]
[signature]
Posts: 7,663
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2006
Reputation:
0
Fisrt off let me state clearly here that I am the novice of novice fly tyers. With that in mind I was doing some searching on the internet for fly tying videos. I was on youtube.com I beleive and used tying flies as my key words... or close to that.. one caption that caught my attention basically said tying a steelhead fly by hand.. so I clicked on the link. To my surprise there was a young woman on the screen giving siontep by step instruction on tying a beautiful fly by hand.. no vise.. and using standard materials such as 6/0 thread and feathers etc. I will say I sat there in awe at what she was doing and the result was simply beautiful work.
While she was tying she mentioned several times where she learned her craft and I beleive it was the gentleman DR mentioned. I beleive that she also mentioned several times for sources that could be used to learn to do what she was doing.
I went back today to see if I could find that link again but was not able to.
I am sorr I am not able to give more information or the link but Im willing to guess with more internet search you will find what you are looking for...
MacFly [cool]
[signature]
Posts: 1,774
Threads: 0
Joined: Jan 2005
Reputation:
0
Cabala's had a portable vice kit for under $30.00.
I have it and it works great for small and large flies.
If you are close to a Sportsman's Warehouse, they also have one and a better upgrade kit for under $40.00.
The cost of one good dry hackle neck is more than that!
Do yourself a favor and get a cheep vise!!!
[signature]
Posts: 7,663
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2006
Reputation:
0
... agian not an expert here but just did another search on you tube and got the following name.. Selene Dumaine.. did a google search and found numerous links to her work.. maybe this will help to give you an idea of viseless tying..
MacFly [cool]
[signature]
Posts: 9,402
Threads: 0
Joined: Aug 2003
Reputation:
0
[cool][font "Poor Richard"][green][size 3] Hi there Santaaa & thank you for your interesting post. [/size][/green][/font]
[font "Poor Richard"][green][size 3] I think that your question has generated a number of good responses. A pair of good vise grip pliers would work although you would need a tabletop vise to hold the former in place. Have attached a photo of I took using a vise grip pliers holding a # 18 dry fly hook. [/size][/green][/font][font "Poor Richard"][green][size 3] I have been tying for only about a year but cringe over the thought of using a vise grip to get started but it can be done. I started off buying a starter kit which included a DnyaKing [/size][/green][/font]
[font "Poor Richard"][green][size 3] vise. From what you have mentioned the price would not be to your liking. Unfortunately I have yet to find anything about fly fishing to be inexpensive. e.g. A package of fly hook [/size][/green][/font][font "Poor Richard"][size 3][green] like the Daiichi #1100 used in the photo cost $4.50 +tax. And the list goes on. BTW a good pair of vise grips will cost at least $10.00 otherwise the jaws of a cheap pair will not hold a small hook firmly enough. Therefore I would suggest buying a White River Fly Shop Classic Vise for only $15.00. Teaching ones self to tie flies will be enough of a challenge versus accomplishing the task of holding a hook firmly enough to get started. Good luck.[/green][/size][/font]
[center] ![[Image: gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=28997;]](http://www.bigfishtackle.com/cgi-bin/gforum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=28997;) [/center]
[center] ![[Image: gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=28999;]](http://www.bigfishtackle.com/cgi-bin/gforum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=28999;) [/center]
[signature]
Posts: 144
Threads: 0
Joined: Jun 2007
Reputation:
0
thanks for the tips. That vice is more in my price range. I probably will buy one. What other tools should I have? Just the basics. I don't want to spend alot of money on something I may or may not enjoy. If I like it I will probably be willing to spend more money on better tools but I want to try it first. I always buy the less expensive things first. I got my Daiwa rod and reel combo for 20 bucks and well I bought a new reel for it but the pole still is holding up and it is my favorite pole. I like my fly rod alright. I just bought a bumble bee popper made in the USA. It is alot different then the flies I had bought. It is alot heavier and casting it feels different. I had a bit of a rough time with it today but I think I am slowly getting the hang of it. I did not catch anything but a fish jumped at the popper but unforunately it missed.
[signature]
Posts: 7,663
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2006
Reputation:
0
I dont know what you limit is but I can tell you that a few months back I bought a decent kit for 60 - 70 dolloars.. it included a good vise and most of the tools recommended by tyers on this board.. bobbin.. bobbing threader.. whip finisher (which I replaced with a different one).. scissors and a couple of other tools I dont remember.. came in a hard wood case that I can work from.. I also bought a fly kit which gave me directions and materials for 12 hooks.. all totaled it ran about 75 for the start up.. I got this at my local fly shop and I am sure if you check with yours you can find a similar kit.. so far I have messed with it a few times but have not had the time to sit down for an extended period of time to concentrate on it.. I am sure when I do I will be a happy camper.. like you I try to be cost effective at first and then upgrade as needed...
Hope this helps..
MacFly [cool]
[signature]
Posts: 19,235
Threads: 2
Joined: Nov 2005
Reputation:
1
Two things you will need are the Thread bobbin (and get the one that is ceramic in the middle, the cheaper ones will only break thread) and a good pair of scissors. It is possible and a lot of people prefer making the finishing knot by hand. If you want to do hair flies, a hair stacker and maube hackle pliers although I have never used them.
[signature]
Posts: 26,682
Threads: 0
Joined: Jul 2003
Reputation:
0
Wow! I guess you got off for cheap on your starter kit.
I ended up buying 2 different vices. One will handle the smaller hooks but won't do the bigger ones and the other handles my 12/0 hooks but bites the big one if I try to use it for smaller flies.
Both vises ran close to 140 bucks. Then I got all the Bobbins, Bodkins, threaders, Hackle pliers, different types of scissors, whip finisher and a few other goodies for a grand total of close to 300 bucks. This is mid 80s pricing so you know it was some good stuff back then. The good thing about it is that I am still using the same equipment because it still works.[cool]
Some of my flies are catching little guys like this!
[inline "Cuda 55.JPG"]
[inline rednwhite1.JPG]
[signature]
Posts: 7,663
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2006
Reputation:
0
...like I said it was just a starter kit I bought at san diego fly shop.. it is not top of the line but a good set to start with and see if I like it... I could not remember all the tools in it except those I named before.. if you want I can bring it with to Elsinore for a look see...
btw.. great pics of some great looking fish.. there are days I wish I had your job... [  ]
MacFly [cool]
[signature]
Posts: 26,682
Threads: 0
Joined: Jul 2003
Reputation:
0
The only downfall to my new job is that I can't call in making an excuse to go fishing instead of working.[pirate]
[signature]
Posts: 7,663
Threads: 0
Joined: Oct 2006
Reputation:
0
....now that is funny....did not think of that [sly]
MacFly [cool]
[signature]
|
