Thoughts on Drag Systems ??

[BigFishingShop]

Hi everyone, I just purchased this reel on ebay mainly because it is a Hardy, England and I just couldn't pass up the deal ($65.00 US + 7 ship). I was just starting to read about drag systems when this deal presented itself so didn't have time to ask anyone [:/] . Hardy ANYTHING in closed listings is hundreds of dollars and few never sold only because they had high prices already on them.

So now am stuck [laugh] with this beautiful old Hardy double click pawl drag reel and was hoping to further my understanding of the systems. It's a Sage Model 106 by Hardy, England. So pawl drag vs. disc drag ?? :

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Thanks,

BFS [fishin]
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[flygoddess]

NICE SCORE! What weight is it?
Hardy made reels for several companies. The Older Orvis CFO (with the rivets in the back) were made by Hardy.
Spring/ Pawl aka Click/Pawl is a wonderful sounding reel. Nothing like it!
The drag is no where near a disc.
I had that same Sage reel. I ended up selling it to my brother. The cage all the way around the housing made it tough to PALM the reel and as I mentioned, Click/Pawl is NOT a strong drag.
BUT, drag can be over rated[laugh] EXCEPT WHEN THAT BIG FISH RUNS! LOL

Seriously though, that is a sweet reel and the drag is adequate.

You can reverse the drag by switching the little triangle things. Be very careful when opening it up as those springs have been know to go flying.


HANG ON TO THAT PUPPY! And if I remember right, be sure it is totally dry before storing. I didn't and had a bit of a rust problem.
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[macfly55]

what about this one sis

[url "http://cgi.ebay.com/ORVIS-ROCKY-MOUNTAIN-FLY-REEL-ex-spool-5-6wt-England_W0QQitemZ200267702835QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item200267702835&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C39%3A1%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C240%3A1318&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14"]Rocky Mountain[/url]

MacFly [cool]
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[BigFishingShop]

Hi flygoddess, cool, because I am just about to buy a much nicer one, for much less I think, that the seller never worded the auction to be found lol. Yeah I have been reading about dissipating all the heat generated by drag on a reel, the forces involved on that little spool are impressive.

Thats why it,s hard to find a good small hub one. Hardy isn't just some Name that's time honered, these reels are built to some pretty serious engineering, materials, and machining/construction specs. Was a period when the steel, aluminum, alloys etc. coming out of Europe was so incredibly strict in it's standard, ANYTHING you buy today is pretty much junk in comparason, take an electron microscope and gas spectrometer to show it.

Interesting stuff, will be reading more, ooh 4 mins to go as I write, may have a pic here soon, this one has original box and everything, is xlnt cond. and spooled up with line too.

A cut and paste of my work, whew, check this out Macfly,(my new ebay buddy) this only had one bid, at $9.99 for the entire auction until, and was smart enough to bid high : Damm just high enough again 66 bucks I bid.



[url "http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260306845327"]VINTAGE SAGE MODEL 106 IN EXCELLENT CONDITION WITH BOX[/url]
Time left: 5 secs
History: [url "http://offer.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewBids&item=260306845327"]3 bids[/url]
Your current bid: US $61.00
Your maximum bid: US $66.00
and paying [laugh] ......

Ok back at ya lol, BFS, always multi-tasking $69 shipped, Price of the new Chinese thing at fly shop, I want to add for anyone reading, there is some serious physics involved with fishing, much of this brand new stuff may really look cool and "Seem" quality, but it's not proven,

and be very aware, they (Manufacturers and dealers) aint ashamed to be writing their own very wholesome looking reviews, AND DO !!! . Do some good study before you invest, if your reading this, it's just a Google search away.

There's seriously someone out there with a case of Whatthe's right abouts now lol: He Must be REELING [sly]notice the 5 seconds left, was impossible for other bidder to react, time he hit his mouse it, was over. The Haul :
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Oh yeah, this one says 6/7 wieght, and the other one doesn't say but is spooled with WF6F, and they appear to be identical , both model 106. We have dams everywhere up here and landlocked salmon, steelhead, and sea run cuts all year so never know what ya might land going for trout. I need a fish winch that can take it.

Oh yeah FYI flygoddess thanks to some wonderful info donations by engineers, the drag system isn't weaker, it's different, IMO better, that "weaker" your feeling is supposed to be like that, if you could really pull it , for a distance, and hard, it goes to work, similar to the inertia brake in the seatbelt of your car. you can pull against it easy and lean forward, but yank it and it locks up.

You are much less likely to break anything when the fish strikes, you still have drag to maintain the hook set and if the fish runs, that drag goes right to work. The progression to disc drag/braking was because the pawl drag system generates an impressive amount of heat that must be redirected out and away from your bearings, too expensive to build like they used to, beyond that is over my head, they use cork as a heat conduit inside pawl reels, pipe it away, it's pretty cool stuff.

Thanks, yeah that is the coolest sound, just like on Jaws,

click.....click............click click............. click click click.......

BFS [fishin]
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[flygoddess]

The Rocky Mountain Traditional. Made by BFR (British Fly Reel)
Nylon cartridge, fair ball bearing drag.
They sold for around $60.+ new and cartridges around $20. Getting hard to find Cartridges. For $50, I can think of better reels however.
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[flygoddess]

The drag on a SPRING/PAWL is nowhere near some of the gear drags. I agree it is adequate, but you can't LOCK UP a spring pawl. Not that you would want to, but there are times you do need to be close.
I have had to tighten my gear reels before, for one reason or another, to leave my one hand free. Yes I do hold the line with my finger, but a few cases I have need the reel to STOP.

Not many cases, that is why I now use the RIM DRAG made by Vosseler.
I think Spring/Pawls were designed, like the Vosseler, with enough tension to prevent back lash.
But, like I also said, the Sage has a CAGE around the whole reel. No PALMING the reel.
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[macfly55]

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[flygoddess]

WHAT?[laugh][laugh][laugh][laugh]
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[macfly55]

sorry bout that sis.. was gonna reply here then sent you a pm instead.. :-)

MacFly
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[BigFishingShop]

Yeah that's what I have always done too, just pinch the line off if I had to. I always have had a fit with any adjustable drag while I'm fighting a fish, it's like driving and talking on the cell phone at the same time for me.

I had to cut my study short as the auctions were just rolling by, but there is a lot more, pros and cons, may even find tweaks, who knows, was just starting to read about adjustments when had to decide jump on deals. but am really looking forward to trying, I can fully see having a simple levered drum brake to go with it you could push with your thumb on the back like the release on a closed face spinning reel that would work with it if needed extra brakes, would be simple, could use leather as a liner on the pad and would just push down manually on the outside of the reel , leave enough room for over winding etc. Oh is that like the rim drag you are talking about ???? Ill have to go check it out,

Yeah that's my pro on this particular setup is I dont like farting around adjusting drag in the middle of fish wars,
most fascinated to see it . Will be coming apart in little pieces soon as it arrives, just like dad's drill [laugh],

Other pro is... ... I break stuff lol , not likely to break this. Even the ones that look like they were drug behind a truck all their lives say "still works fine" in the auction.

BFS [fishin]
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[Dryrod]

[center][font "Garamond"][#008000][size 4]Hey there BFS when trying to be the last bidder, bid an odd amount - like $17.58. The next bidder might just go to $18 not realizing that his $18 is not an increment of a $.50 increase.[/size][/#008000][/font]
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[BigFishingShop]

Hi Dryrod, thanks. I found that practice only seems to drive the price up though so I place my bid at what I figure is a good deal,(the highest amount I am willing to go) and by that I figure that at the amount I I will be bidding, with shipping added, I can turn around and sell the item, whether I needed it personally or just saw a bargain worth making a few dollars on, and feel it would be worth the time.

I will research the closed listings to see what that same or similar items have actually sold for first to give me a very good idea. Figure what I am willing to pay, in the case of the Hardy reel, it was 66 dollars so at 20 seconds left to go, that's what I will enter even though it has been sitting there at 10 bucks for the whole week with only one bid, that ten bucks may likely, and in this case obviously was, the starting price for the auction, NOT the bid.

That one other bidder wanted that and was willing to give 60 so that was his actual bid that you cant see, but being the start price was 10 bucks, that's what shows, anyone bids say 20 and enters, his 60 cap automatically kicks in and overrides the 20 by a buck.

now says 21 now and bidder 1 still has his bid locked in at 60, will play that scenario until that 61 dollar mark is reached.

Now, he's the only bidder and it says 10 but hes bid 60. and I have in this case valued it just a bit more at the 66. If I tried to find the bid he put on it any other way, he may well go higher, he already wants it 60 bucks worth so must know what it is. I bid my 66, confirms at 3 seconds left, end of story, If my 66 was not enough, which often is the case, oh well, on to the next of maybe 60 or 70 items I am watching, I haven't spent my 66 dollars, nor had I allowed myself the opportunity to get caught up in a bidding struggle that would likely cause me to invest more that I had rationally slated for it with time to research and think.

Hope makes any sense, if not, ebay has some of the best tutorial for the process out there,

BFS [fishin]
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[Dryrod]

[center][font "Garamond"][#008000][size 4]Duh what did he say?[/size][/#008000][/font]
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[macfly55]

DR....

I think he was speaking ebay talk.. and that is a totally foreign language.. LOL>>

basically translated.. you set you limit or max bid.. and then start it all going.. you can set it on an auto bid.. so as someone else bids .. you automatically outbid unless it goes over you max limit....

you do this as a means of determining the minimum bid on the product if one has been set by the seller..

you also do this to find out what the other bidders max is..

the last part was a strategy of final bid... it takes about 10 seconds for someone to react and the system to recognize they have been outbid...if you time it just right you can get the last bid in and the other person cant react in time..

at least thats my take on it..

MacFly [cool]
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[EvilAsh]

Were you planning on using this for steelhead?
I'd might want to think twice about that if you are.
For trout in a river or stream, or lake, it'll be a great reel.
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[BigFishingShop]

Hi Evil, no, looking at a couple of Battenkill 8/9 s for sale, looking at all kinds of stuff, bought those after reading a bit about them and they are selling for much more.

Got in 3 rods now and all functional 2 reels, a clicker and a disc drag, both 5/6 so what I am doing is getting deals on a bunch of different stuff and learing about it and will be fishing real soon. may take that one and mod it, make a brake. Just trying stuff out,

thanks
BFS [fishin]
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